Harappa script

As long as we do not have any bilingual text with Indus Script as the other there will bunches of speculations and some people deny that it is script. Script YES - literature not. This is reply to By Steve Farmer, Richard Sproat, and Michael Witzel aspects. They bang open doors

Harappa, Indus Script, Asko Parpola

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This is answer to the http://www.catshaman.com/essays/harrapanl.pdf "The Collapse of the Indus-Script Thesis: The Myth of a Literate Harrapan Civilization" By Steve Farmer, Richard Sproat, and Michael Witzel
.
Since there no finds of Indus literature the answer is simple and there
could be no debate on the header -;) The longest script has 17 signs and
could not be called literature by any means. The Indus Script is like an
unsolvable enigma and open for all kinds of speculation and nothing could
be proven as long as we have no bilingual samples.

I guess there is no single answer to many different samples from different periods-
However, maybe it is the place to comment the thesis of By Steve Farmer,
Richard Sproat, and Michael Witzel since they evidently ask for debate.
These gentlemen goes to the other extreme saying that the signs are not
logograms like contemporary scripts. I think we by ocular inspection can
deduce that the Indus people were intelligent in class with contemporary
cultures.

There is no reason to class the logograms as meaningless
scribble without order and meaning. Another fact is that 20 out of 32
early Brahmi signs could be found in the Indus syllabary. It is just a
little sign that Indus Script is script and not writing.
.
The first sample of their methods shows they have difficulties in using
the concept "congruence and relativity" it is as if they compared pears
and strawberry or horse riding and football. The Indus Script is generally
from before 2000 BC and should be compared to contemporary scripts. The
"seals" with boss are as idea like the clay labels found in Egypt before
3000 BC with a couple of glyphs that could be read as a date. The Indus
Script should be compare with pre-cuneiform and pictorial glyphs/
logograms in Egypt.


Another congruence we find in the use of icons at monuments in pictorial
script in Egypt, Sumer, and Indus. Hittitian is younger and should be
compared with care but they use also certain icons in picture stones. The
authors have a sample of Luvian script, but I do not think they understand
Luvian /Hittitian.
.
They have encircled the logogram for leader on page 32 that is an oval
with crossing stroke. We know the meaning since in some seal/ AEDICULA it
replaces the priest king. In Nordic rock-carvings we have the same kind of
symbol with single line and sometimes looking like a footprint. In some
cases there is a double crossing line. We can read as "leader" but do not
know if it is virtual god or a real leader. In all ancient scripts we find
signs/ logograms used as sign for some important feature in society.
.
They do not understand Indus either when they use the M-634 tablet on page
35. They tell there is the "rare … sun-power symbol". But in Indus they
parted the year in 2 x 6 moons/ months and the signs stand for "moon-year"
or season since they tri-parted the moon year. The tri-parting reached
Scandinavia maybe in last millennium however the old crossed circle/
swastika for the sun year is most used. In Indus we find the swastika as
early as 4th millennium.


In Scandinavian we still use the expression 'heavenly ocean' and heavens
looks like that a blue clear day. Asko Parpola shows that the fish-sign
surely stands for 'star' and that means all objects in the sky. He reads
it MIN and compare with Dravidian and Tamil. There is the sign 'fish with
and angle (roof)' and he believes it stands for some planet. Maybe we
should set it 'pole star' or star of the sphere that never disappear of
sight. Surely these stars were like the nobility of heavens.
.
In general the interpreters know too little about the early zodiac /
Animal Round and they do not realise that calendar and stars/ asterism
guided their life. We could not call it astrology before last millennium
when city dwellers used astrology as fortune telling mechanism. Earlier
farmers needed the real guide and calendar. In Summerian symbolism they
mark the deities with a star showing that it was a heavenly aspect or
virtual idol.


At page 41 they show boundary stones that are a lot younger than Indus.
However these gentlemen do not really understand them. They are calendars
with the entire year as asterisms or zodiac signs and they have introduced
the astrology term "house". At the top there are symbols for sun, moon and
morning star. Venus/ Morning Star symbolised Underworld and originally
Sumerian Ereshkigal. At right I suppose they overlook the Water-snake that
symbolise the Season. At left we have it as the "horned snake" at bottom
that extends from Cancer to Scorpio … curiously we find the Horned Snake
also in some American rock-carvings
.
They point at the "omega-sign" but that is sign of "rising node" for the
moon calendar … see
Moon Suite. At left on first row there are
two houses with the quadrupled horn crown. It is from the time when
Taurus/ Bull was leading star and it reads that they followed the Bull
during four quarters. In Egypt there is late symbolism when some temples
followed Khnum / Goat during four quarters. In India they had the He-Goat
Rbhus and the name stood for first third as well as for the order of
tri-parting. In the seals we should read the illustrations / animals and
the script as a whole. Like other cultures Indus had its own Animal Round
of which the Unicorn and He-goat are the best known.
.
Greek Linear and Cypriot are the best-known syllabic languages that use
around 80 logograms for writing. Like most contemporary script they have
also icons/ signs that stand for specific nouns. An icon stands for a
whole concept or dynamic process. Since Indus Valley was influenced and
bartered with Mesopotamia and Egypt we could deduce that they used script
in same kind context.
.
I do not think these gentlemen really understand the mythical symbolism in
the samples of Indus script we have. The frequency investigations are of
no use as long as they do not understand what the script is about. They do
not prove that there was no meaning and no sounds/ phonemes corresponding
to the signs. In short the gentlemen do not contribute to understanding
the Indus seals and tablets with signs.
Cheers
catshaman